26
May

Saturday Salon – Scandalous Women, or Professions for ladies that must be whispered behind fans

Greetings, lovely guests! The other day I was reading about the Golden Horde, and—

Miss Ashe, we have barely finished mending the place after that ship incident Miss Noble instigated. If you invite an army of Mongolian barbarians to my home I will shut my doors to you forever.

Oh, hello, Lady B! <looking around confused> What are you doing here today?

<lifting her lorgnette> Upon the previous occasion I consulted with Lord B, this was still my house, Miss Ashe.

Ha. Er. What I mean is, you’re not usually here on Saturdays. But no matter, I digress! Speaking of the Golden Horde, as you know when I’m not in the ballroom I’m teaching history—

Lord help us all.

—and last term I taught a course on the interesting ways in which medieval Christianity is represented in modern fiction and film.

You are a remarkably peculiar gel, Miss Ashe.

I know! It was so fun. My students researched and wrote fiction too. One project was about Christian missionaries to the Golden Horde, and it reminded me of how in the Middle Ages Christians told stories of the Mongolian invaders that included thoroughly scandalous details.

Finally a topic of interest.

Gorgeous however remarkably uncomfortable birthing table

It was rumored that even the womenof the Golden Horde were savage warriors and that they didn’t pause in their fiendish invasions even to give birth, but bore their children from the saddle. Isn’t that fabulous?

It sounds remarkably uncomfortable.

I daresay. But it got me thinking about scandalous professions for women.

All professions for women are scandalous.

I know you don’t really think that. After all, you share your ballroom with authoresses!

Lady B casts me a look that suggests I’ve just made her point.

But it’s a time-honored reality, my lady. Women have forever been pursuing professions that society considered scandalous. Why, just remember all those mistresses Sabrina brought to the ballroom.

squawk! Scarred for life! squawk!

And speaking of women using their feminine wiles to advantage, one of my favorite ancient plays is the political comedy Lysistrata in which the wives of leaders of the embattled Greek states withhold sex until their husbands call a truce in the war.

Behind the scenes politics. Impressive.

Wasn’t it? And in the Middle Ages there were cross-dressing monks — women in disguise for years and years! — and a famous woman soldier or two as well.

squawk! Pre-guillotine days! squawk!

Jeanne d'Arc, icon for French feminists and fascists alike

Yes, Albert, unfortunately Joan of Arc’s military cross-dressing got her burned at the stake in France. But there’s another famous medieval cross-dressing Joan. The legends call her Pope Joan. They discovered she was a woman when she sat down on the papal throne and the bottom fell out of it, revealing the truth.

One wonders why the witness had his head beneath the throne.

Doesn’t one? Those crazy medievals! In fact, just the other day I came across some lovely ladies on twitter— er— that is, at the park chatting about yet another medieval woman whose behavior scandalized everyone. Now… who was that queen…

Ashlyn Macnamara: Eleanor of Aquitaine. She was queen of two kingdoms consecutively, started a civil war between her sons and her husband, and rode bare-breasted to the crusades with her ladies in waiting to rouse the soldiers’ spirits.

And other parts! squawk!

I daresay.

Ah, and here are the very lovely ladies I was tweeting— that is, strolling with the other day! Lady B, may I make you acquainted with Ladies Ashlyn Macnamara, Alyssa Alexander and Tracy Brogran? And you already know Anna Randol (who visited us in January with her dreamy warrior-poet hero!).

Of course I am acquainted with the Dashing Duchesses, you silly gel. Who isn’t?

Katharine: <beaming at the duchesses> It’s wonderful to have you here today, ladies. Will you do me the honor of adding to my list of professions of a scandalous nature for ladies?

Tracy: Well, I’ve heard from a very reliable gossip that there’s an Englishwoman trying to gain admittance to a medical school in New York. Can you imagine? Elizabeth Blackwell is her name. She lives in the Americas now, no wonder. But it’s said that she was allowed entrance only because the administrators thought for certain her application was a ruse.

Tell me the poor gel is at least married. On the other hand, if she isn’t, my fourth cousin thrice removed, that fellow just over there staring down Mrs.

Alice Guy-Blache, the first female cinema director

Cres-

Tracy: Elizabeth chose to never marry. Imagine? A maiden, traveling back and forth between the Americas and our homeland, encountering all sorts of riff-raff. I’m certain she encountered the most nefarious of ne’er do wells. But she did manage to establish quite a few dispensaries to aid the infirmed.

<squawk!> Learning opportunities all round!

Ashlyn: And a chance to ogle a few, er, legs.

Lovely.

Anna: At least she was mending people. Alessandra Giliani in the 14th century— did you ever meet her, Lady B?

Perhaps there is a reason I do not normally attend Saturday salons.

Anna: Alessandra carved them up. She’s credited with being instrumental in developing a way to map the human circulatory system. On cadavers no less. All before she was 19.

Alyssa: Medical school! Anatomists! But no! <fanning herself while searching for her smelling salts>  But they weren’t the only women comfortable with a blade.

Do tell. I fear you will whether I allow it or not.

Alyssa: Rumor has it that the Assyrian Queen Sammuramat (also Semiramis) gained the throne in a most nefarious — though clever — way. After impressing the current king with her strategic battle skills, she asked if she could be queen for a day. She promptly had him beheaded, poor sap, and ruled for another couple of decades.

Remarkably clever gel. Though most unpleasant for the king, I should think.

Alyssa: He clearly did not think through her request, alas. And since the rumor is her son had her beheaded, well, she had her comeuppance.

squawk! What goes around, comes around.

Alyssa: Indeed, indeed. I must say, it is only rumor, however. The Greeks rewrote her history a couple of times. But the scandal sheets are always more fun than the truth. <wink> So I shall follow the scandal.

Tracy: Follow the scandal? Shame on you, Lady Alyssa! <she lowers her voice> Come sit by me, will you?

Boudica on her chariot, trouncing the Romans.

Ashlyn: If we’re going to mention ladies of a military bent, we can’t leave out Boudica, who led an uprising against the Romans. Of course, they took her kingdom away from her, had her flogged and raped her daughters, so some might say they had it coming.

Anna: Or Fu Hao in Shang Dynasty China. Queen, military leader, and high priestess. Trounced the barbarians so soundly they never attacked again. Over a hundred swords, axes, and spears were discovered in her tomb.

<peering through her lorgnette> Fond of weapons, was she?

Katharine: Which puts me in mind of ladies of the sea, with great big gun arsenals at their disposal.

Anna: Ah, those sailors with their large cannons…oh, you meant actual cannons. <clears throat and sips tea>

Tracy: Have you seen the size of their balls? Enormous. The cannon balls, I mean. <fans herself and looks askance>

Aarrr! squawk!

Katharine: <endeavoring with no little effort to maintain my Serious History Professor-like mask> Yes, indeed, Albert, there was a remarkable number of women who devoted their lives to sailing ships, including female pirates like the infamous Anne Bonny and Mary Read, close friends and both fierce buccaneers.

Alyssa: Scandal! <gasps> How fun!

squawk! Walk the plank! squawk!

Katharine: Neither met a happy end. But that’s what you get for breaking the law.

Ashlyn: Thus, Boudica.

Katharine: Quite! But some ladies like my own Viola Carlyle in How To Be a Proper Lady worked their shipcraft within the confines of the law. Viola is a privateer. Everybody here knows what a privateer is, right?

The duchesses and Albert nod.

Good heavens. Yet another ponderous lesson in history approacheth.

Katharine: Very funny, my lady. A privateer is—

A thief with license! squawk!

Ashlyn: The bird speaks the truth of it.

Katharine: Exactly. As Violet la Vile, Viola is commissioned by the state of Massachusetts to scout out nere-do-wells and haul them into port. And if she wins a lot of booty from the ships she brings in, well that’s how she pays her crewmen.

Flag of the state of Massachusetts which flies above Viola's ship

Anna: <whispering to Albert> Do you suppose she wears trousers? Or has she learned to scramble around in the rigging in her petti…<realizes everyone’s staring, sips tea> I said, isn’t your hero, Captain Jin Seton, a privateer too?

Katharine: Ah, yes! But he holds his commission from the British Navy.

The plot thickens! squawk!

Katharine: As sorry as I am to deviate from speaking of a delicious hero for even a moment, we’re getting away from the point of this writer’s inspiration post. After all, the reason I wanted to talk about this is because of the amazing courage, bravery, and plain old chutzpah these women had to do what they did.

Tracey: Miss Blackwell says, “If society will not admit of women’s free development, then society must be remodeled.” Perhaps she’s on to something.

Katharine: Like Viola, overturning societal conventions. Why just look at her. She’s ripping his “bodice”.

Bodice ripping: The good kind

 

squawk! No guts, no glory! squawk!

Katharine: Precisely.

 

Thank you to Ashlyn, Alyssa, Tracy and Anna for visiting the ballroom and inspiring us today! I hope you’ll all dash over to The Dashing Duchesses blog and pay them and their sister duchesses a call. But before you go, tell us what is the most scandalous job you’ve ever had? If you’ve been modest in your employment, then what’s the most scandalous job you could dream of having if you could do anything without suffering any consequences? 

Under albert, heroines, historical figures, historical inspiration, katharine, lady b, saturday salon, special guests, uncategorized


  1. May 26, 2012
    7:02 am
    Janet W

    Proper ladies pah! My most scandalous lady in literature before I discovered romance was The Grand Sophy! She knew all the rules and proceeded to break most of them. Driving herself past the Men’s Clubs, wielding a pistol, shooting her friend to stage a romantic scene … I think Heyer barely scratched the surface with Sophy.

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      10:50 am

      The Grand Sophy is truly fabulous! Wonderful example, Janet.


  2. May 26, 2012
    8:24 am

    I’ve been a teacher. I’ve worked retail. But the most scandalous job I’ve ever had is the one I’m doing right now. As a novelist I get to let my mind wander and dream up the most decadent scenarios. Then I get to share them.

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      10:51 am

      It’s really a deliciously scandalous profession, isn’t it, Ashlyn?


    • May 26, 2012
      3:41 pm

      Well said, Ashlyn! I’ll bet the neighbors look at you funny now. *g* I know mine do me.

      Welcome! Thx for visiting us today!

      Gaelen

    • Sabrina Darby
      May 26, 2012
      3:43 pm

      Lol, being a novelist can definitely be scandalous. Especially when you are engaged in research.


  3. May 26, 2012
    9:36 am
    Lisa

    Great post Katharine! I enjoyed learning about these fascinating rule breaking scandalous women.

    Unfortunately,my emplyment history does not include any scandalous jobs, though a scandal or two has happened.

    Besides being an aspiring romance novelist writing delicious stories with happy endings, the most scandalous job I can think of would be that of a spy working for an intelligence agency like the CIA or MI6. Imagine all the cloak and dagger, and being privy to all sorts of juicy secrets and covert information.

    As for my favorite scandalous women in literature/romance, I’d nominate Maya Rodale’s Writing Girls. The books are so well written and such fun, and I love the idea of independent women who band together, support each other, and defy conventions by pursuing writing careers in an era when such things “just weren’t done”.

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      10:52 am

      Oo, intelligence work sounds exciting, Lisa! Though I think I’d be afraid of the good chance that I might die in some horrid manner, of course.

      I adore Maya’s writing girls. They’re so marvelously intrepid and adorable!


    • May 26, 2012
      11:37 am

      Lisa, I was thinking about Maya’s Writing Girls too. : )


  4. May 26, 2012
    10:55 am

    Wonderful post, Ladies! The cannon reference made me off my chair (thank goodness no one was underneath!)


  5. May 26, 2012
    10:55 am

    Writing is indeed a most scandalous profession. Why all day long we let our minds wander into the most deliciously naughty places. Encourgage them, even. I, for one, cannot imagine a more titilating endeavor. Thank you so much for inviting us to your lovely Ballroom!

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      4:28 pm

      It’s such a pleasure to have you here, Tracy. Thanks for dropping by! And yes indeed, encouraging all those scandalous ideas is so much fun!


  6. May 26, 2012
    10:58 am
    Margs

    Writing would have to be the scandal. (All those thoughts…hmmm.) Great blog. Love that she’s now the bodice ripper. My, my how times have changed.

    • Sabrina Darby
      May 26, 2012
      3:46 pm

      I love that cover too!

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      4:29 pm

      Thanks, Margs! I’m so glad you like my bodice-ripping cover. The moment I saw it I cheered. It’s perfect for this couple. :)


  7. May 26, 2012
    11:23 am

    Aside from writing love scenes, I’m not sure I’ve done much that’s scandalous….though I did work one summer in a central office for a major fast-food chain, where I handled letters from people who’d found weird things in their burgers. Often, they’d tape what they’d found to a card and sent it in. Very, very gross. No scandal on my part, but if I’d publicized what I learned….ergh….


    • May 26, 2012
      3:01 pm
      Tessa Dare

      Oh my gosh. What a job!


    • May 26, 2012
      3:42 pm

      Keep hanging around here, Elisa. We’ll make a hoyden of you yet. *g*

      Gaelen

    • Sabrina Darby
      May 26, 2012
      3:46 pm

      Haha, that is definitely an interesting job.

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      4:29 pm

      Oh how completely gross and TMI for sure. But I do think writing love scenes is scandalous enough for a lifetime as well!


  8. May 26, 2012
    11:42 am

    Hello Ladies, one and all!! This was SO much fun today!
    Anna seems so innocent and reserve but we know the truth – cannons, indeed. : )
    Another woman who comes to mind was Mary Anne Evans, better known as George Eliot – scandal was her ‘middle name’! Her poetry was sensual and instigational, she smoked and drank as well as gambled. She scandalously lived with a married man for over 20 yrs and denied the Christian faith! Imagine!

    I’ve taught English, sold homes, run a doll-making business but I think deciding to dive into my blog and write romance novels, even though still aspiring, is my most scandalous endeavor – public anyway. ; )

    Have a great long weekend everyone!


    • May 26, 2012
      3:43 pm

      George Eliot… she’s a man, baby…

      Gaelen, who’s always up for an Austen Powers reference

      :::waving to Ames:::


    • May 26, 2012
      9:02 pm
      Duchess Anna Randol

      Obviously, that was a simple mistake. I mean, that’s what everyone thinks of when they hear about cannons, isn’t it? And large arsenals? And perhaps masts?

      *crickets chirp*

      Oh, perhaps I should remain quiet…

      • Katharine Ashe
        May 26, 2012
        10:17 pm

        Of course it’s what everyone thinks of, dear. Naturally.


  9. May 26, 2012
    2:59 pm
    Tessa Dare

    What a great post! Welcome, Dashing Duchesses!

    I *love* reading and writing about women in unlikely historical professions – have written female doctors/healers, a female geologist, a female artist, a linguist…

    I agree with Ashlyn that writing romance novels is the most scandalous job I’ve ever had personally!

    But as for what I most want to do/read/perhaps someday write… I have a thing for female pirates. Or thieves. :)

    I also am so intrigued by this story of Jean/Jeanne Baret, who was an 18th century explorer/botanist who disguised herself as a man in order to accompany her lover on his expedition. She collected the first bougainvillea specimen – how cool is that?
    Baret’s story

    JeanneBaret.jpg

  10. Miranda Neville
    May 26, 2012
    3:22 pm

    Welcome to The Ballroom, Duchesses. We are delighted to have you here. [looks around the room, peers behind potted plants]. Where are your dukes?

    Like everyone else, I’ve never been paid to do anything particularly scandalous, except write what my daughter calls “Mom’s Smutty Books.” In my childhood I occasionally aided and abetted my father in the hiding of extra bottles of wine when passing through customs from France to England. This was obviously excellent training for writing Regency romance. (I haven’t done smuggling in a book yet, but I’m so ready to nail the emotions.)

    There two jobs I wish I had the talent to do, neither terribly scandalous but definitely “out there.” I would love to be an opera singer or a stand-up comedian.


    • May 26, 2012
      3:24 pm
      Tessa Dare

      LOL. Good point, Miranda. “Bring out your dukes!”

      • Sabrina Darby
        May 26, 2012
        3:48 pm

        Haha, it’s almost like we’re asking for a boxing match…


      • May 26, 2012
        4:50 pm

        At least it’s not “put up your dukes” or, worse, “bring out your dead…”

        My duke currently is drinking beer, snacking and watching golf. Where did I go wrong?

        • Katharine Ashe
          May 26, 2012
          10:19 pm

          He sounds like a charming duke, Ashlyn. I’m certain on other occasions he waltzes and trades jabs at Gentleman Jackson’s. Right? :)

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      4:31 pm

      Smuggling! Ladies, we’ve had a criminal in our midst and never knew it. A toast to Miranda! Now… when will we get to see you on stage???


  11. May 26, 2012
    3:35 pm

    Welcome, Dashing Duchesses!


  12. May 26, 2012
    3:39 pm

    It’s so nice to meet you ladies!!! Welcome, Dashing Duchesses, one and all. So glad you could join us, and I love all your stories about those remarkable women from history. I definitely learned something today!
    Whoa, who knew Eleanor of Acquitine was a flasher? And doesn’t that Victorian doctor lady look like Gillian what’s her name who used to play Scully on The X-Files??

    My most scandalous job…geez, I have admitted to more incriminating things on this blog than I”m sure is wise…

    Well, when I was a 17 year old my boyfriend of all people got me a summer job driving a lunch-break delivery truck around to … wait for it… factories and construction sites. That’s right. Me. 17. Skimpy summertime shorts. Up to my neck in my sweaty, muscley construction guys. I got asked out rather a lot. LOL. I sure loved buzzing around all over the city in that little truck, though. The downside was having to start at 5:30 AM every day, but then again, I could be poolside by 3pm so that was fun. Eh, I was a teenager, what did I care, lol. I think my boyfriend back then kinda regretted getting me the job. Back in my troublemaker days.

    I’m an angel now, though. Seeeeeriously…. *g*

    Gaelen

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      4:34 pm

      I love hearing about your troublemaking days, Gaelen! And what a summer job! I am hugely jealous. My most exciting summer job as a teenager was selling patio furniture. I kid you not.

  13. Sabrina Darby
    May 26, 2012
    3:51 pm

    Welcome to the Ballroom, Duchesses! So glad to have you hear sharing all these wonderful stories of intrepid women.


  14. May 26, 2012
    5:00 pm

    So much fun! I had a scandalous job for all of one day in high school… I was bound for college and veterinary school and considered myself quite the intellectual. Unfortunately, I was also quite the POOR intellectual. And so I offered to fill in for a friend who delivered balloons for a local party shop. I didn’t balk when I found out I needed to do it in a leotard and a bunny tail/ears. But I changed my mind pretty quick when after my first delivery… to the local Ford Dealership full of ogling 50 year old men.

    I did it. I just never did it again. :)

    • Miranda Neville
      May 26, 2012
      8:40 pm

      That’s a terrifying story, Jennifer. I am writing a note to myself; never take balloon-delivery job.

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      10:21 pm

      I love it! Put me instantly in mind of Bridget Jones at the annual Tarts & Vicars party. :)


  15. May 26, 2012
    5:10 pm

    Thank you for our discussion, Katharine et alles. I’ve never had a scandalous job.

    But years ago I daydreamed about what it would be like to be an amazon. Not the dot com kind; I mean a woman warrior. I funneled these daydreams into a number of heroic fantasy short stories and novelettes, several of which got published.

    Well, that was then. Nowadays I regard being a warrior–or any job in which someone must kill or be killed—as bad karma for anyone of either gender. They’re both suffering the effects of bad karma they’ve already created and creating more of the same.

    Not for me, thank you. Not even in my daydreams.

    Good luck with your new release!

    • Miranda Neville
      May 26, 2012
      8:42 pm

      I always fancied being an Amazon, Mary Anne, until I read the bit about cutting off one breast to accommodate the strap for your quiver. Thank you, but my devotion to greatness only goes so far.

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      10:24 pm

      Mary Anne, that’s precisely what Eleanor and her ladies were attempting to mimic when they rode along with her husband’s crusading army — Amazons. Legends of warrior women have held a thrall on the imagination of western society for centuries, indeed.


  16. May 26, 2012
    7:15 pm

    Ahem, I must momentarily interrupt the fun to point out that that is a photo of Alice Guy-Blache, the first female cinema director, not Dr. Elizabeth Blackwell! This website features two pictures of Dr. Blackwell: http://bit.ly/JWIjvC

    But to return to our regularly scheduled program, Alice (who, coincidentally, was Judith Ivory’s inspiration for the heroine of Dance) oversaw 700+ films during her twenty-five year career, started her own production company in America, and managed to snag the Légion d’honneur in 1953. I’d say that’s a scandalous woman with a scandalous profession during the Belle Epoque!

    • Katharine Ashe
      May 26, 2012
      10:25 pm

      Thanks for the correction, Evangeline! And Alice sounds suitably scandalous, indeed!

  17. Kate Noble
    May 27, 2012
    12:24 pm

    A belated hello to the Dashing Duchesses! It’s like the world’s most fabulous cocktail party in here!

    My job history is sadly less than scandalous — there were jobs I disliked, jobs where I was assigned slightly odd tasks (I once had to fly to canada to deliver a wig) but all were completely respectable.

    Sigh — I guess I”ll have to leave scandal up to the heroines in my head…


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