12
Jul

Star Spangled July: What if England Had Won the War of 1812?

Dear Ballroom Guests, Shhhh…..

If you’re wondering why I’m whispering this afternoon, it’s because our fair hostess, Lady B., has dozed off in the shade, decorous snores arising from under the brim of her fetching straw bonnet, chilled lemonade nearby, painted fan in hand, and one of the authoresses’ romantic novels sprawled across her chest. I hope it wasn’t mine that put her to sleep, but the heat these days could undo any lady of her delicate constitution.

 Ah, Constitutions… that brings to mind my topic of today.

While our aristocratic English lady dozes to prepare herself for the night’s festivities, I have a rebellious message to give you from the erstwhile Colonies. 

Happy 236th B-Day, America

As you may know, the summer of 2012 marks the 200 Year Anniversary of the War of 1812 – the “second war of independence,” right in the heart of our dear Regency period – a moment in history when America nearly lost her freedom.

 

Wikipedia Commons - War of 1812 Montage

 

 

This fact was driven home to me when I went up to Lake Erie to tour the beautiful brig, Niagara, a surviving American battle ship from the War of 1812. That ship bears the scars of that war. The docent (and current captain) of this historical sailing vessel tells of how her decks ran ankle deep with blood.  The whole story of how a small American fleet was hastily built on the shores of Lake Erie – at the time, a raw frontier – was awe-inspiring to me. Northwestern Pennsylvania had always had lots of good timber, but in 1812, there was no one for miles around who knew how to build a ship.

But the country was under attack. An invasion force was on its way, hitting the East Coast, with another battalion coming down into the Heartland by way of Canada. It was a national emergency, and experienced shipbuilders had to be rushed into all the way over from the coast of New England (especially Rhode Island). If not for their ingenuity and skill, we may well have lost our country. 

Me & the Niagara

Indeed, when I visited the Niagara with my dearest “E” (Eric) that day, I was struck by the thought that if things had gone differently in 1812, this little known and supposedly minor war could have changed the entire course of human events on planet earth.

Why?

Because there would have been no America. The grand experiment of the Founding Fathers would have died about the same time that Napoleon’s empire did on the other side of the ocean, at British hands. (One wonders, if the War of 1812 had dragged on a few more years, might the Crown have sicced the Iron Duke on us once he finished off Napoleon? Shudder!)

By 1812, the Founding Fathers who still survived were old men, and the birthright of freedom they had procured at such a dear cost had been passed on to their now grown children and the first crop of grandkids, who would have been in their late teens and early 20’s. It was “Liberty: The Next Generation” and the Empire was about to Strike Back.

Things had been quiet for a good twenty-three years. The fresh trouble started when the British Navy instated a policy of impressing American sailors into service. You see, America was technically neutral in the war between England and Napoleon, that  staple of Regency romance and endless supply of tortured romance heroes. But the British did not entirely buy America’s neutrality. Nor did they like the fact that American merchants continued to do with Napoleon’s France despite England trying to outlaw this. Therefore, the British instated a policy of stopping and searching American ships they came across. Unfortunately, they did not stop there.

Suspicious that their former colonists were possibly colluding with Boney, they treated American sailors more like rebel Englishmen or criminals, and pressed them into service on British ships. Presumably the Brits were desperate for more hands on deck, given that they were in the fight of their lives against the quasi-Hitler of the 19th century, Napoleon. It didn’t matter.

Making a slave of an American is just about the worst thing you can do to us. President James Madison left off fighting the bankers who wanted to establish the Fed, and convened his Cabinet. After a huddle, the U.S. government declared that these seizures of American men by British Navy captains was an act of war.

And so, the fight was on. Would the new generation of Americans have what it takes to remain independent, or would they buckle and fold under pressure like a cheap suit? 

Because freedom, as we say each year on the 4th of July, isn’t free.

(I can’t do justice in this blog post to the complexities of the War of 1812 or the heroism of the generation of Americans who won it, but if you want to learn more, check out http://www.visit1812.com/history/ or http://starspangled200.org/Pages/Home.aspx or read Chapter 5 of A Patriot’s History of the United States by Professors Larry Schweikart and Michael Allen, entitled “Small Republic, Big Shoulders, 1789-1815” for an overview.)

The threat from England was very real. If anything, the Brits were more motivated than ever to get America back under their control. With a twenty-year war underway in Europe, they needed the money, man-power, and natural resources that America is blessed with. The War of 1812 is a fascinating subject, but since July is America’s birthday month, I thought it might be interesting to look at what might have happened and how our lives might be different if things had gone the other way—if England had indeed won the War of 1812 and regained control of the United States.

I am not a history expert, and I don’t play one on TV, but extrapolating fictional ideas out of historical facts is the job I do every day and have done for 15 years. I thought while Lady B. is napping, it might be very interesting to talk a stroll down Alternative History lane. So here we go. 

Putting on my historical writer’s hat, here is what I propose might have happened if the British had won the War of 1812 – good and bad:

1. In an age of “honor” and saving face, the first order of business might well have been payback time. The elderly Founding Fathers who still survived would’ve been hunted down, arrested, and hanged as traitors to the Crown.

2. Slavery never would’ve taken hold in the United States the way it did, because England had already outlawed slavery in 1806. There would have been no need for a Civil War.

3. The Native Americans would also have been treated very differently. King George was fascinated by the American Indians and had decreed that the Colonists were not to set foot over the Alleghenies. Lands beyond these mountains were to have remained Indian territory. In the War of 1812, the Shawnee chief Tecumsah forged a confederation of tribes to fight on the side of the British. Who knows how long the Crown’s good intentions toward the Indians would have lasted? But at least there was initially a kindness there, despite the Founding Fathers regarding King George strictly as a tyrant.

4. If England had won the War of 1812, America probably would’ve been consolidated and combined with Canada, and with these massive natural resources–on top of England’s dominance of the sea AND being the leader in technology at the time (early Industrial Revolution)–I cannot help but think England would’ve become a Mega-Superpower even decades before the height of the British Empire under Queen Victoria. However, if that had happened in 1812, that would’ve set off the 19th century diplomats’ sense of the all-important “Balance of Power,” and therefore…

5. It would have changed the whole fate of Europe, as well. The other nations in Europe would have seen a Mega-Superpower England as a dire threat and might well have rallied around Napoleon whether they liked him or not, to provide a suitable counterbalance. My bet would be on the flip-flopper Czar Alexander of Russia changing sides again, to stand with Napoleon against this gigantic rival. 

So there’s my “World-Building” (as we say in fiction craft) – whew! – the big picture of how world history might have been different, but what about life in these United States? How would it be different today if England had won the War of 1812?

1. Americans would have better manners *grin* (just kidding!!) and would probably prefer tea instead of coffee.

2. Hilltops throughout the United States would likely be dominated by lavish stately homes, where aristocrats with their own special set of laws would look down on the rest of us. (In Regency times, you went to jail if you were a common man who punched an aristocrat.) Since they were the landowners—and note that English aristocrats had already purchased or been granted extensive American land holdings, especially in the South–it is likely that most of us today would rent rather than own our homes. Just make your rent check out to the Duke of Devonshire, or whomever. 

3. They’re great in fiction, but in real life, the presence of aristocrats among us would have resulted in a class-based society. In America we have different socioeconomic levels, but these are fluid. A person can change from one socioeconomic level from another depending on how much money they happen to be making in any particular time. Class is permanent.

I heart Sean Bean

Even today, here’s an example that drives me nuts. Every time some snooty British magazine writer interviews one of my favorite actors, Sean Bean, the writer makes sure to snidely point out that the actor’s father was a welder. What does that have to do with his movie roles or his training as an actor? Absolutely nothing.
          But they make sure to bring up this fairly irrelevant detail just so you’ll know exactly where on the social totem pole this man should be viewed, no matter how many blockbuster movies he’s in or how much money he makes from them. No matter how accomplished an actor he might be, he will always be viewed a certain way in the eyes of those who see everything through class.
          Needless to say, to Americans, that attitude is demeaning. We judge people based on what they themselves say and do, not on who their parents were, and for everyone, no matter their birth, the sky’s the limit. 

4. If England had won the War of 1812, there would’ve been no Elvis, no Willie Nelson, no Lynard Skynard, no Aerosmith, and probably no Louis Armstrong, no Ella Fitzgerald, no Mo-Town, and no jazz. These forms are unique utterances of the American spirit. JMO.

 ROCKIN’ LIKE IT’S 1976…

5. There would have been no “melting pot of the world” for all of those immigrants who came to America for freedom of religion. England was certainly tolerant of other religions in Prinny’s day, but those believers did not have the same rights as members in good standing of the official Church of England.

In closing, if England had won the War of 1812, I believe the biggest difference would have been in the American character. Being born into 19th century England meant being told your place and accepting it. This is anathema to the American spirit.

Freedom of the sort our Founding Fathers envisioned and passed down to us meant at its core (at least to me) that YOU decide for yourself what you’re going to be.

With the Constitution, the Founders set up conditions originally intended to get government out of  the people way’s, freeing them to create whatever they wanted to create and to become whatever they wanted to become. 

Lady B (stirring from her slumber): Gracious I can’t believe I nodded off. What is going on here? What are you whispering about?

          Gaelen: Why, good afternoon, my lady. I was just making conversation with our friends here. Today I’m asking – What is your favorite period in American history? What bygone age in America’s past captures your imagination? Pioneers, Victorian Boston bluebloods, Jazz Age flappers, Greatest Generation, hippies…?

Under gaelen, history


  1. Jul 12, 2012
    7:46 am
    Lisa

    Great post Gaelen! And what an interesting question. I’ve said it before but I’ll say it again. I’ve always been fascinated by the WWII era, the way how the whole country, and world really, banded together to fight evil, and how its effects can still be felt today in terms of technology, economics, geo-politics, etc and the move towards a more global culture.

    And I also have to confess I’m also fond of the 1920s jazz/flapper/Prohibition culture too. I’ve always wanted to learn the Charleston! This was also the decade the 19th Amendment passed, and I’d like to think I would have been in the midst of the fight for women’s suffrage.

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      11:28 am

      Thanks, Lisa, glad you liked it! Wow, that would’ve been fun to be part of the women’s suffrage struggle–though the gestapo type police tactics got pretty brutal on those women in some instances, if I recall correctly.

      I lived in Charleston SC for a few years and it was a blast going to the Dixieland jazz bars. I’d move back there in a heartbeat, but then I’d be a Damned Yankee instead of just a Yankee. (In southern parlance, the former are the ones that move down there and stay lol, as I’ll bet Virginian Amy already knows! lol.)


      • Jul 13, 2012
        1:48 pm

        Gaelen, I’d never call you a ‘Damned Yankee’ besides, I was actually born in the middle of New York Harbor and didn’t move to VA till I was five so I could almost be considered one – that’s almost, y’all!! *wink*


  2. Jul 12, 2012
    9:44 am
    Jamie Beck

    I have always been drawn to the Colonial and Regency periods the most. I also like Victorian and Edwardian periods of history.

    As for if the British won the War of 1812, I think if they did win, the American Spirit would still try to get their independence – we, as a nation, are stubborn like that. I can see the South being like they are – proud Rednecks and be that way in defiance. Now, maybe not ALL of them, but a percentage. Does make we wonder if middle America would be British, too because that was a land grant from 1803. Would Mexico be bigger or would Britain try to annex them next? Questions, questions! Makes you think, doesn’t it?

    I, too, love Sean Bean. ADORE him and it is interesting to see all the ways his characters have been killed off. As a person, his normal accent (though dreamy) gives himself away. To the entitled English, Sean is and always will be that Yorkshire blue collar boy, who did well for himself. To America, he is a great actor, who has a large female fanbase. :D


    • Jul 12, 2012
      10:15 am

      I totally agree with you, Jamie, that had we lost at any point in our goal to win freedom, we would have just won it some other way. Americans cannot be put down – we will always persevere. : )

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      11:34 am

      I have been wondering lately why there aren’t more Regency-era romances that actually do take place in America. I hope you’re right about the American spirit still thirsting for independence. I am a little skeptical though, because it was only a slim majority that wanted to break away from Britain in the first place. A lot of Colonists were pretty comfortable with the status quo and didn’t think it was worth it to take on the superpower of their day.

      Your comment about Sean Bean’s characters always being killed off made me laugh! OMG Boromir!! I could not BELIEVE they killed him off in LOTR. I had forgotten that from the book, but when I realized Sean wasn’t going to be in the other movies, I almost didn’t bother watching them, lol. Fortunately, there was still Viggo. But for some reason Orlando Bloom does nothing for me. I guess he’s just too young for me.


  3. Jul 12, 2012
    10:13 am

    Fabulous post, Gaelen, thank you for showing an alternative possibility to the world we know as a result of a change in history – you did good, girl!!

    My favorite time in OUR history is when our country was being born – Colonial Times mid 1770′s! One of the great benefits of having grown up and still living in Virginia is being surrounded with the history of those times. I love the reenactments and visiting the places where things actually happened. To experience the sense of what it was like to be THAT rebellious against what was a superpower at the time is extraordinary and thrilling!

    Sean Bean – what can I say? I don’t care that his father was a welder that just means the man has a good solid character building role model. And he’s gorgeous!! *sigh*

    Great start to a long Thursday!! xoxo

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      11:35 am

      Thank you so much! Glad you liked it! I hope I can get to Virginia before the summer is out and visit some of the great historical sites I haven’t seen. I’m open to any recommendations you might have as a local!
      :)
      G.


      • Jul 12, 2012
        10:09 pm

        Oh my, where do I start in recommendations – definitely Williamsburg, Mount Vernon, Monticello and there are loads of fabulous vineyards including one near us in Widewater, Stafford called Potomac Point Winery that feels like you’ve traveled to Provence in France. Lots to see and nowhere near enough time. If you travel straight down I-95, you can see Mount Vernon then the Fredericksburg battlefields and the home of Mary Washington and the Lewis Estate, then on down south to 295 to 64 east to Williamsburg and Yorktown and then if you want go a little further, you two can spend a day or two at Virginia Beach!! Whatever you do in Virginia, enjoy!!! xoxo


  4. Jul 12, 2012
    10:48 am

    Wow! What an interesting post, Gaelen. I’m glad we won the war of 1812. I love reading about England, but I love America more. My favorite time in American history is the Wild West (cowboys). Also, since I’m a Texan I love the Alamo. I also love Sean Bean!!! We watched all of “Sharpe’s Rifles” on Netflix. I hated for those to end.

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      11:38 am

      Hi Susan! Wasn’t he dreamy in those Sharpe movies? Yow. And how cool that you’re from Texas! Now you’ve put me in the mood to read a good cowboy romance. Another fun iteration of that is the Steampunk Wild West, which you see from time to time. An odd combination!

      Glad you liked my post. Thanks for commenting!

      It is hard to imagine England and America at war all these years later. Nowadays we’re usually on the same side.

      Have the London Olympics started yet? I am not a sports person, I don’t have a clue… Anyone watching them?


      • Jul 12, 2012
        1:27 pm

        The Olympics start July 27th. They’re fun if you watch from the first day.

        • Gaelen Foley
          Jul 12, 2012
          8:34 pm

          Oh, thanks. I will try not to miss the Opening Ceremony especially! :)


  5. Jul 12, 2012
    11:49 am
    Kathleen O

    This was a wonderful post and very thought provoking. Being Canadian, I have a different perspective as we were under British rule for many years after the war of 1812. Canada still of course has the British Monarchy as it’s head of the State, but we have our own laws and parliament. The Prime Minister heads up the country like your President. But I think if America had not won the war of 1812, I wonder if there would have been that sweet southern accent I adore so much.. But you would have had all the glamour of Royalty…

    I loved many era’s and one talked about in my family was the WWII era of the 30′s, 40′s and post era in the 50′s.. I always thought I would fit in so well in this era.. Because I love the music and the clothes of that era and love those big movie musical productions…

    But I like the US and have many, many friends through out your nation and the two countries have always got on well. So all well that ends well.

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      12:18 pm

      Well said, Kathleen! Glad you liked the post, and thank you for adding the Canadian perspective! That is so interesting! I was pretty torn while writing the post at seeing the cultural tragedies that might’ve been avoided if England had remained the ruling power here, but then again, the world would sure be different.

      Thanks for commenting. How do you think Canadians regard the topic of class? I’ve never felt like my Canadian friends shared the class awareness that some English people like the magazine writer I noted in the part about Sean Bean seem so preoccupied with.

      Another vote for Greatest Generation times, I see! I had the honor of meeting a lovely Englishwoman at a wedding shower recently who had been a 12-year old in Coventry, England during the Blitz. She had some incredible stories to tell… she married an American GI and has lived here ever since.

      Thanks for commenting. :)
      Gaelen


      • Jul 12, 2012
        12:27 pm
        Kathleen O

        I don’t think we really worry about class distintion. We are too much a melting pot of people, races, religions and creeds.
        I like that part about Sean Bean. I mean what does it really matter what one’s father or mother did for a living. If they were good people with good values, then that is what should be what matters….Right….

        • Gaelen Foley
          Jul 12, 2012
          8:35 pm

          Thanks – that’s what I would’ve guessed, based on my Canadian friends… and the college I went to in Fredonia New York was not far from the Canadian border and Niagara falls.
          :)
          Have a nice night!
          Gaelen


      • Jul 12, 2012
        6:02 pm
        Pamela Fox

        Gealen, I am an Australian of 3 & 4 Generations. My family were from the British Isles. They came here from England, Scotland Northern Ireland between 1850 and 1866.

        What I am seeing from your Great Post and KathleenO’s is that we who live in a country with the British Monarch as Head of State and with his/her own repesentaive and the Prime Minster for a term of about 3 to 4 years are just as well off as one with a President elected for 2x 4 yrs terms

        Each country has it’s own unique lifestyle. Many who came to Australia between 1788 and 1868 were Convicts from England and in the later years Ireland. Though Many Aussies, myself included, can claim a Convict Ancestor, I see much alike Americans admitting that they have a Slave or two in their Ancestry.

        There is little or no class distinction here in Oz . I Love Sean Bean also and have read ALL the books as well they certianly described a battle scene.

        My GGGFather was a LifeGaurd for Queen Victoria in the 1840s till he stole. This had him sent to Western Australia where he married, had children and the family is now in the 1000s.

        I had wondered if you ever thought of putting on of your villins onto a tranport hulk in the Themes Gealen, he could have a short enough sentance to come back to England 7 or 8 years later

        I leave you now as I go back to bed this cold morning to read one of your books #4 of Inferno Club
        Pamela


        • Jul 12, 2012
          6:04 pm
          Pamela Fox

          My faverite time period is the Regency Georgian and Early Victorian

        • Gaelen Foley
          Jul 12, 2012
          8:38 pm

          Wow, great family stories, Pamela! Incredible about your GGGfather. Wow! Thanks so much for chiming in. Well, this is great – we’re hailing from all over the place here today. Maybe all the countries that trace their origins back to England should be considered cousins. :)

          LOVE the idea of putting a villain in a Thames prison hulk, too! thanks for suggesting it! I will store that away in my idea folder! You know I do love my diabolical villains. *g*

          Hope you enjoy Inferno #4! You’ll be all set for October when #5 arrives. :P

          Enjoy your evening, everyone!
          Gaelen


  6. Jul 12, 2012
    2:35 pm
    Jeanne Miro

    Gaelen -

    My favorite time period was right here in little Rhode Island in 1972 when the patriots (pirates or drunk townspeople depending on your viewpoint) burned the British Ship the Gaspee! Why we still have a parade each year to celebrate the occasion!

    On the other hand things really haven’t changed too much here over the years but they call themselves politicians now!

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      8:40 pm

      Hi Jeanne!
      Nice to “see” you here today. Now there is a story I did not know, lol. Sounds very colorful, LOL. What on earth provoked them to burn the ship?
      Rhode Island is a state I’ve never been to but hear is just beautiful and would love to visit.
      :)
      Gaelen


      • Jul 13, 2012
        12:43 am
        Jeanne Miro

        Gaelen -

        Some say that it was the action taken by the “rebels” rebelling against British rule and the American Revolution!


      • Jul 18, 2012
        6:59 pm
        Delia Daza

        You should come to our Little Rhody! We are the smallest state but it’s beautiful! I’m not originally from here but I’ve lived here for over 30 years now, and I just love it.


        • Jul 20, 2012
          1:43 pm

          Sounds wonderful! :) I’d especially love to see the famous Gilded Age mansions in Newport. From what I hear, they’re pretty stunning!


          • Jul 20, 2012
            3:25 pm
            Delia Daza

            OH yes they are! Also the East side of Providence, has many old beautiful homes and Brown University, Johnson and Wales, RI School of Design :)
            Newport has as you said those beautiful mansions but also James Town right next to it is a gorgeous town. But of course I love anything with the ocean near it LOL.
            If you ever come this way let us know :)

  7. Kate Noble
    Jul 12, 2012
    4:55 pm

    Wow Gaelen! You paint a picture of alternate history that is as tantalizing as it is frightening.

    As for my favorite American time period, I love the gilded age in New York City. The social and economic leaders of the day ruthlessly worked to get to the top, and the lower classes were burgeoning with the possibility of unions, entrepreneurship, and building… always building.

    Plus, Worth gowns were the boss.

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      8:44 pm

      Hi Kate! I love that era, too. It’s wonderful that so many photographs were preserved so we can see what the world actually looked like then. I enjoy looking at them.

      You make a good point, too, about it being a time of great energy and dynamism. Hmm.

      Oh, for a time machine to visit all these eras!!!
      :)
      Gaelen

  8. Miranda Neville
    Jul 12, 2012
    8:28 pm

    Fascinating post, Gaelen. I’d love to discuss this for hours! Two comments come to mind.
    1. I do not think that a British victory in the War of 1812 would have been the end of things. The Americans would have got rid of them in the end because they’d be an occupying force. You cannot rule another country indefinitely without the will of the people. The American ideals were already entrenched.
    2. Re. Sean Bean. I thinks it’s a little more complicated. Brit. popular culture is very against the “posh” these days. Pointing out his working class origins is good PR. (Which is not to say the class system isn’t alive and healthy – it just gets played down.)

    I admit I have a preference for eras where the clothing was really attractive. (I know, I’m shallow). So I’ll go for the Gilded Age -I adore Edith Wharton – with an honorable mention for the 60s. (Mad Men!)

    • Gaelen Foley
      Jul 12, 2012
      8:42 pm

      Thanks for your perspective on the class thing, Miranda. You know, now that you mention it, I am reminded of a Monty Python skit where the guys play self-made millionaires each trying to outdo each other with how lowborn they were and how poor they were when they were children. Pretty funny! Maybe there was a tone of irony intended in the article that I just entirely missed.

      Cuz you know, when anyone criticizes Sean, my Irish comes out. :P

      I second you and Kate on the Gilded Age. I LOVE the 1870′s bustle gowns. SO elegant, but I’m not sure I”d want to have to wear one everyday…

      :)
      Gaelen

      • Miranda Neville
        Jul 12, 2012
        9:32 pm

        I’d be happy to watch Sean Bean wield a welder’s torch :)

    • Sabrina Darby
      Jul 13, 2012
      12:31 am

      I am totally with you on Gilded Age U.S. Love reading stories in that time period. I also love Gold Rush California. Actually, I love anything California history.


  9. Jul 13, 2012
    1:47 am

    This is all so interesting, Gaelen.

    I do have to agree with Miranda, that even if the England had won that war, they couldn’t have ruled America for long. The army was stretched so thin by the middle of the decade.

    But the possibility of slavery having met a swifter end…that would have been worth a few extra years of British rule, I think.

    I will also join the Sean Bean love heap. He was part of my mental collage for Thorne in A Lady by Midnight. :)


    • Jul 13, 2012
      1:54 pm

      Oooh Tessa, now I’ll see him in my head while reading that one. Great hero image – thanks!

      One of the reasons I started watching GAME OF THRONES was because he was in it and a very major character and then they killed him. I keep hoping against hope that he will suddenly turn up alive and well to save the day. I don’t think so, right?


  10. Jul 20, 2012
    10:43 am

    I love your speculations on how a British victory in the war of 1812 would have affected the US (now and then).

    I’m personally fascinated with the American Civil War era. There have been a lot of scholars in recent years who have posed the same sort of speculative questions, about what would have happened if such-and-such had happened (or not happened) before, during, and after the Civil War.


    • Jul 20, 2012
      1:44 pm

      Glad you enjoyed it!

      You are reminding me of the Abraham Lincoln Vampire Slayer movie, which was gone from the theatre before I got a chance to see it! LOL. But I realize that is NOT what you mean… ha ha.

      :)
      Gaelen


  11. Jul 23, 2012
    10:25 am
    Andy Smith

    But…America didn’t win the War of 1812. I haven’t the foggiest idea where this strange ‘outcome’ came from, but the USA was ‘thwarted’ by the small British Army and Canadian forces over the border when the USA attempted to invade Canada. Apart from some significant successes on the Great Lakes and at sea, the Canadian invasion was a complete and utter failure. The British attacks on the American mainland (plus the burning of Washington DC) was something of a very severe ‘smacked wrist’ and was never intended to be an invasion and occupation. ‘Tis ironic that the Battle of New Orleans (USA 1, Great Britain 0) was actually fought after the peace treaty had already been signed & sealed (but, sadly, not delivered). So, I suppose, the whole War could be termed (technically) a ‘draw’.


  12. Jul 26, 2012
    7:54 pm

    Hi Andy, thanks for chiming in. I agree with you that on paper, it was a draw, but in today’s America and probably then, too, it was felt to be a threat to national sovereignty. And I think one can understand why.. a very young country with an angry superpower amassing a fleet of was it 400 ships on the East Coast? If things had gone as expected, Britain could’ve wiped us out and then what would’ve stopped them from coming down in a heavy handed way? I think America as a republic would have been quickly brought back into the fold…or something. I gather it was a very near thing. But fortunately, our countries are friends now and all’s well that ends well.
    :)
    Gaelen


  13. Aug 2, 2012
    9:56 am
    Andy Smith

    Absolutely! The War of 1812-1815 is seen (in the UK at least) as a part of the larger Napoleonic War…Wellington had all his best troops (Penninsular veterans) over in the US by Waterloo…and was jolly well worried about the fact too. Thank goodness that the Prussians helped to turn the tide!

    By the way…I think the Knight novels (both sets) are great…my partner (Sarah) and I are heavily involved in Napoleonic reenactment/living history (plus Regency dancing); she read ‘em all and then passed ‘em over to me. As a ‘bloke’ I resisted at first and then started with ‘The Duke’…damn and blast…too late…I was ‘hooked’. I read the lot in a manner much like a ‘chain-smoker’, one after t’other!

    • Gaelen Foley
      Aug 2, 2012
      1:04 pm

      Wow, many thanks! So glad you’ve both enjoyed them.

      So PLEASE tell me more about your Napoleonic reenactments!!! I am obsessed with this stuff, though I am a terrible Regency dancer, lol. Definite wallflower.

      Does your group have a website? Must. Know. More.
      :)
      Can hardly wait for 2015 for the bicentennial of Waterloo. All the best and thanks for visiting again!

      Gaelen


  14. Aug 6, 2012
    6:59 am

    For the website, try http://www.themilitia1815.weebly.com (plus, my group is also a part of the UK’s Napoleonic Association)…as you can see, our 1813-1815 ‘guise’ is as Prussian Landwehr (1/3rs Silesian).

    In the next edition of ‘Skirmish Living History’ magazine (end of August)there might be an article (and photographs) of mine published on some of our Regency recreations (but don’t hold me to that!)

    The group’s next project is to recreate some sort of early 19th century sports ‘event’ with some single-stick fighting, bare-knuckle boxing, cock-fighting (with Balinese-style puppets), ‘pedestrian’ competitions (ref. Captain Barclays wagers) and a nicely sedate cricket match. But how we can do this safely without knocking our teeth out bare-knuckle boxing remains to be solved (or cracking our shin-bones as cricket pads weren’t around in the early 1800s)! Needless to say, there will be much ‘betting/gambling’ and imbibing of alcoholic refreshments as we are all splendid Corinthians!

    As an afterthought…have you discoverd the short novels of M C Benson (The Six Sisters novels and Hannah Pym ‘The Travelling Matchmaker series)? Very funny, plenty of Regency commentary and ‘flavour’ (and a quick read).

    Yours

    Andy


  15. Feb 17, 2013
    1:13 pm
    david

    Never read as much tosh in all my life. Britain DID win the War of 1812 even expending only a tiny fraction of her resources. What cant Americans face reality?
    All attempts to conquer Canada were easily repulsed and the British could land anywhere on the American seaboard and raid punitively- witness the sacking of Washington. Your braggart President couldnt run away quickly enough.
    New England was ready to secede from the Union.
    It would have been better for the native peoples and the black slaves had Britain won, as they would have been freed immediately. 700,000 American lives would have been saved as there would have been no Civil War.


  16. Feb 19, 2013
    12:49 pm
    david

    And by ” England ” do you mean Great Britain?
    You cant even name your adversary correctly.
    Ever looked at the Union Flag ( Jack ) ? That blue Saltire as the background is SCOTLAND.

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